Graham Sheffield, Artistic Director of Barbican Arts Centre and Chair of ISPA, in conversation with Delphine Minoui, French-Iranian journalist and theatre critic and Makoto Sakai, (New National Theatre, Japan),   at Live Theatre, Newcastle upon Tyne, June 21 2005.

Graham Sheffield and Delphine Minoui

Graham Sheffield asked the guest speakers if the arts were changing lives in their respective countries.

Delphine Minoui told us how the election of President Khatami in 1997 marked the beginning of a new life for the arts in Iran. About 60% of the population is under 25. From the Islamic revolution in 1979 to 1999 theatre in Iran was dead. Now there are a few plays beginning to tour.  One in particular, “Dancing on Glasses” can be described as experimental theatre. The play was first performed at the university in Tehran, now going on to London, deals with issues if identity, the rejection of politics, and suicide.

Traditional theatre in Iran is religious.  The new generation of artists is looking for new styles from the outside and getting rid of revolution and religion. There is a big gap between the traditional and the new. Contemporary artists deal with the issue of censorship, with what cannot be spoken, by using a lot of metaphors. All dramatic work goes through a number of culture censors.  First the language is stripped, then the play goes to rehearsal, then it is performed for a jury.  Then new cuts are made before the play can be performed before an audience.   Once on the stage, the pressure continues as more conservative members of the public or public officials respond to what they see.  There is only minimal political support for the artists.

Makoto Sakai explained how Kabuki started in the 17^th century as a public art form and became tremendously popular.  The play was never as important as the music and the spectacle. From 1868 Japan welcomed western culture.  Kabuki declined in popularity because there was not enough encouragement from the government.  Even now western plays are often adapted into Kabuki style.  The first national theatre in Japan was built in 1966-1997 with support from the people not the government. Traditional Kabuki theatre mirrors the traditional relationship between master and student, father and son.

Makoto Sakai

Graham asked if there are contemporary writers in Japan using traditional forms or are they writing western forms?

Sakai replied that modern theatre plays are adopting western style.  There isn’t much relationship between Kabuki and western traditions in Japan.  Actors trained in Kabuki style can perform in contemporary plays, but not the other way around.

Graham asked Delphine about coping with censorship, commenting that writers are often cleverer than censors coming up with slightly new improvisations every night. Is there pressure from the public to hear uncensored material? Is the theatre playing the role of political parties? 

Delphine described how painting has gradually moved away from propaganda.  There is still censorship, but there are too many private galleries for officials to control.  

Robin Archer reflected on the importance of subversion in forcing metaphor. She feels that “Dances on Glasses” represented a peak and that theatre in Iran is now in decline. The current conservative backlash means that much of the theatre in rehearsal will never reach the stage.

Robyn Archer at Live Theatre

Michael Barry wondered if there was an ideological focus to the protest theatre. 

Delphine replied that it was too early to talk about ideology.  Most of the young theatre troops are going to pick up western plays such as Beckett’s “Waiting for Godot” because it’s easier to criticize indirectly through the stories in other plays.

In response to a question about social protest in Japan, Makoto Sakai replied that the opening play in the new National Theatre on October 22, 1997 was about the emperor and racism.  Before that time social protest was taboo, but that day marked the beginning of change. 

Who subsidises and supports these young companies.

Theatre is state-controlled on the whole in Iran.  Often young people pay for the performances themselves - rehearsing in bedrooms. When the play makes it to the stage, they are paid nightly (but not enough to survive).

Delphine explained the role of the Iranian Diaspora in creating new work.  A particular influence is the annual Paris Iranian festival which is growing in size and importance and is beginning to be more political.

What opportunities are there for the actors training in Japan and Iran?

In Iran - there is mostly theoretical training (some courses at university). There is a lack of practical training. Some foreign groups have helped.

In Japan, for example opera singers began with Japanese teachers but now we are inviting many international teachers to train singers in the evenings. Ballet - all lecturers are from Japan. There is a two-year course; students then moved to the company attached to the new National Theatre. In dance there are more influences from Britain Germany France etc.